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Things I am learning - The Pivot Safety Blog

Investigations need great conversations

9/10/2025

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Picture
When I coach investigation teams I am listening to the language being used.
If investigation team members use words like, evidence, corroborate or statements that tells me something about how they see the people involved. Often the language used suggest that their worldview is one in which people are unreliable components in a system or process and that their behaviour has not lived up to expectations e.g. "they didn't follow procedures", "it’s a behavioural issue", "they were not compliant".

The Social Psychology of Risk training I have completed has helped me listen more deeply than I used to. One of the most important books I read was Martin Buber's book I and Thou. This book is about the nature of our relationships with one another and how real connection occurs. Buber made a distinction between two ways of being with others. I-It and I-Thou. We can experience other people as objects and use whatever power we have to get what we need from them or in I-Thou we can truly meet people.

When Investigators meet the people involved in incidents there is a choice to be made about how they approach that meeting. In I-It the people we interview become the "IP" (Injured or Involved Person), the "witness", somebody who holds information that we need to prise out of them - they are objects of our attention. In investigation interviews the Investigator uses their power to get to "truth". The interviewees feelings, emotions and concerns are something to manage so that the truth can be reached.

In the I-Thou meeting something different happens. There is a meeting between two people in which a social relationship is created. If those two people meet well then the meeting helps them both. A by-product of this may be that the investigator appreciates the person who they have met in a way that will help them represent that person during the remainder of the investigation.

In the picture you can see my son trying out trapezing. Like the I-Thou meeting, both my son and the expert trapeze artist are taking risks. The power of the expert to control what happens is in no doubt here but they expose themselves to risk to ensure my son can enjoy trapezing. A good Investigator will expose themselves to risk during a conversation with somebody involved in an incident. They will be aware of their power but resist using that power to get what they want. You can read I and Thou for free here https://www.maximusveritas.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/iandthou.pdf​
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    James Sullivan has been helping people tackle risk for 25 years in Australia and the UK.

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